The future for Zetor?

[treaney]

Anyone have any thoughts on where Zetor will go in the future?

Given this week's acquisition of Valtra/Sisu by Agco - see press release on www.valtra.com - (parent of Fendt and Massey Ferguson amongst others), Zetor will have a difficult time remaing competiive on either price (due to manufacuring efficencies) or technology (Euro investment) when operating on its own (within ZTS/Czech government).

What do you folks think?

Tom in Ireland

 

[Renze]

Hmmm... Zetor 's future is bright: I have confirmed from several sources, that:

* Zetor will end the production of all UR1 engines first half of 2004 (due to emission law development costs) and put a UR3 three and four cylinder engines in the "Major" economy line.

* the Super series will be replaced by a Forterra based series, engine as well as transmissions, with 55, 65, 75 and 85 hp, mid to late 2004

* Zetor's in-house developed six pot engine for the Forterra will be available within a few months.

* This one is still a rumor: Zetor will introduce new tractors in the Forterra range up to 160 hp in 2004 or 2005.

As you see, there is a whole bunch of new stuff in the pipeline. A 160 hp Forterra will be one of the cheapest tractors in that power range, so popular for people who usually buy other brands but need a decent rig for harvest.

Last year, lead by HTC, Zetor made profit the first time since 1989, the fall of the iron curtain..

 

[treaney]

Renze,

Unfortunately, and I say unfortunately, because I like Zetor tractors and what they stand for - rugged, solid , dependable power that is relatively inexpensive to maintain and which lends itself to low cost, low tech maintenance....

...I believe that it is going to be increasingly difficult from 2004 on for Zetor to hold onto its market share in Western Europe. As Agco moves forward and deploys technologies such as Vario through MF and Valtra, the cost per unit will drop dramatically. Zetor cannot compete with this. I've just taken Vario as an example but this applies to many things e.g. engine emissions. People's expectations always increase. Look at the car market and its evolution. Today in the car market ABS, air con, remote central locking etc. are not viewed as luxuries but expected as standard equipment. So to it will happen in the Tractor market. i.e Vario/CVT. Maybe with a lag of 10 years but it will happen.

Zetor pioneered the modular platform concept that is being so well deployed by VW/Audi/Skoda/Seat today. I hate to see Zetor lose that position.

BUT.. and it is a big BUT..if Zetor do not strike an alliance with someone, it does not bode well for the future.

If Zetor resorts to non-Western Europe markets for market share, is there the money in these countries to support Zetor? I doubt it.

In Ireland, I saw the impact that Valtra has had in the last 10 years on Zetor and other manufacturers.

Once again, I just wonder where Zetor are headed in the future?

Tom

 

[Renze]

In the current economical recession, Zetor is doing good business in the Netherlands.
They still are price competitive, always been, but the Motokov organisation (government owned) used to be their money eating marketing agent. Motokov is put aside now, in many countries.
Last week the NEtherlands got a new importer, someone cheaper because country legislation dependent modifications are now all done in Brno instead of at the importer, so they wanted a cheeaper organisation inbetween.

When Zetor is going to build a lot more units, the price will drop. The new engines, the 3 pot has been in production for some years, for industrial use. The six pot was developed eatly 90's but they never had the facilities to put them into production.
think they dont have much debts now, and with the new stuff coming out, i think the big six pots will be relatively very cheap.

 

[woodbeef]

After my talk with the gentleman who had the thick Slavic type accent on Wednesday,I think Zetor will be ok. They are keeping their prices down over here,and still working on new models. Just as long as HTC is happy keeping Zetor as a "downtown brand",and not trying to take them "uptown" I think they will survive quite nicely in this new smaller ag-world. HTC is very pro-actively organisizing sales and service in each market. They seem to want to stick around.

As for Valtra....well it's survivial is uncertain unfortunately at this time. But I do think you'll see the lower prices on them disappear very quickly. As for AGCO lowering prices of the Vario equipped tractors...I'd not hold my breath for very long waiting!!

I do not think that all tractors will be shiftless in the future. The majors might all go there,but not everyone will want one. just look at cars,not everyone buys an automatic tranny in them!!

 

[Renze]

Yes, Woodbeef, fully agree with you.

Zetor could never stay in the run with all the gizmos like vario and the such, but you dont need that.
Over here, a 60 year old contractor with a medium sized business, has bought it's first full powershift transmission, a Magnum 7230. That idea came from his 30 year old son, who is the core driver of it. Anyway he will kick it off the yard as soon as he has an electrical failure he cant solve on his own.
They are abandoning Ursus more and more, so i guess he hesitates now, and will be buying the new 160 hp forterra models when they come out.

 

[crystalman]

As long as Zetor can afford to meet the emission and safety legislation in their markets I think they have a good future as a niche product.I would like to hope they remain independent as Porsche have for so long.The continuing merging of the major companies is going to result in huge over capacity with everyone building identical products but painted a different colour.This is stretching brand loyalty too far and the customer will just buy the cheapest version.This is already happening in the car market- VW sales are slipping at the expense of Seat and Skoda.
There will always be a market for a well made reliable tractor that the owner driver or smaller farmer can afford.Not everyone can afford a 250 horsepower powershifting monster but this is the direction the major manufacturers seem to be taking us and as they do their market gets smaller and smaller.

 

[Renze]

Porsche ??
Ferdinand Porsche designed a tractor for Allgaier, which resulted in a takeover by Porsche some years later. Porsche tractors were the victim when the Mannesmann group (from typewriters to steel halfproducts) took over Porsche. Mannesmann closed a deal with Renault, to let Renault use the sales channels of Porsche, Normag and another brand i cant remember.

 

[wen]

I like zetors tractors, but in the usa, I think they are sinking fast.
In michigan I believe they lost over half their dealers. Had to find a dealer every to stock any new ones. I thinks they have to be more aggressive on advertising, cutting the price, and make them move down the road faster. They need better road speed. Would be nice if the new forterra was a 50kph machine.

 

[Renze]

New 11441 we test-drove did 48 km/h on the biggest tires available. Need to fit the Carraro sprung MFWD axle.

 

[woodbeef]

hey Wen,

Michigan is tough place to try and sell anything not percieved as being Made in the USA. Especially anywhere near the auto industry and UAW members!!

AM Jawa is doing very good in the east and south from what I'm hearing. The U.P. of Michigan is selling Zetors also,along with the rest of the midwest.

 

[wequest]

what are the spec on the 114411? never hear of models

 

[Renze]

The 11441 is named 11741 in the States. Over here, we have a 11441 4 pot and a 11741 with SAME six pot (you know them from the Agco Allis series from a few years back)
Because SLH group has bought a big share of the engine division of Deutz AG, they eill end those crappy engines and use Deutz engines. (those new water cooled Deutz engines arent good either but always better than Same)
Zetor will introduce their own built&developed six pot within a few months.

 

[william]

Hi

the sooner we get these 6 pots the better i think as i could do with 2 now really. Still good to hear that they are coming and good to think zetor have a future and long may they be around too. Having one on demo hopefully soon so will report back and hopefully it will pull my dump traillers without too many problems. you got any date for these 6 pots renze.??????

 

[john]

Anyone have any pictures of the cab interior of the forterra . how the passenger seat if they have one?

 

[john]

Anyone have any pictures of the cab interior of the forterra . how the passenger seat if they have one?

 

[Renze]

the cab:

http://www.semex.de/fortkabine.htm

Forterras ploughing: (just look the pics, do not complain about the language)

http://www.semex.de/forterra%20neu.htm#fortterra

 

[wengust]

Decent looking cab on the forterra in the pictures. The only thing missing is the passenger seat. Alot of farmers like to haul a rider, and passenger seats are must for saftey.

 

[Renze]

Over here, they standard come with passenger seat. paying a little more and you can get a comfort passenger seat, or two passenger seats i think...

 

[seat]

To bad that there is no pictures of the comfort seat for passenger seat. would be a nice aftermarket option or wondering if could be special order?

 

[markku]

Im just waiting new model, about 150hp.......

Maybe then I will replace my 6245 with new.....

By the way, Can anybody tell me where is timing marks of engine?

The injection timing marks are on the clutch wheel, but where is the reference mark? I could not found it anywhere??? I was looking it because my 7711 did broken its injection pump

 

[Renze]

Markku, do you have any other tractors besides that 6245 ??

 

[crystalman]

Hello Markku,
I have just had removed the fuel pump on my 8245.She was stalling below 800 rpm and would not idle.The engineers found some wear in the governors and put a stop inside the pump to stop the throttle rack shutting off.Total cost 80+VAT-cheap I thought! Apparently someone had been inside the pump before fiddling about and upsetting things-a common Zetor problem!
My pump will only fit on the engine one way as the drive gear has one oversize tooth to prevent incorrect fitting.Just fit the pump and line up the mark on the pump flange with the one on the engine block and it is fitted and timed.

 

[markku]

Markku, do you have any other tractors besides that 6245 ??

At the moment I have three zetors, 6245, 7711 and 7745. I have two MFs too.

Like much more Zetors, but I will need bigger ones for pulling slurrytank and bigger harrow. I have been looking for some But I havent found the right one. I dont want to buy those new Hi-Tec tractors, those doesnt work properly after few years use....

 

[markku]

Hello Markku,
I have just had removed the fuel pump on my 8245.She was stalling below 800 rpm and would not idle.The engineers found some wear in the governors and put a stop inside the pump to stop the throttle rack shutting off.Total cost 80+VAT-cheap I thought! Apparently someone had been inside the pump before fiddling about and upsetting things-a common Zetor problem!
My pump will only fit on the engine one way as the drive gear has one oversize tooth to prevent incorrect fitting.Just fit the pump and line up the mark on the pump flange with the one on the engine block and it is fitted and timed.

I had the new one on the shelf, it was bought for waiting situations like this. My pump fits only one way, but the timing is not right??? Something strange in the timing gears Propably some of the keys between gears and shafts has been getting loose! (Possible for older Zetor engines. 4340, 6340, 7340 and newer doesnt have this problem anymore)

I should check the gears before happens something bad, but I dont have time for that until next winter....... Lets hope the best.....

 

[Crystalman]

I have seen someone adjust the injection timing with the engine running by loosening the pump bolts and moving the pump slowly until it sounds right?????? But I wouldn't advise you to try it!

 

[markku]

I did it different way! I took off the cylinder head and measured the right position from piston. Timing is absolutely right. This can be done without remowing cylinder head, but fuel injection nozzles was stocked so tight that I couldnt take those off!!

But its working again!!